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+--- الموضوع: من هم السبعين نفسا الخارجين من صلب يعقوب؟ (/showthread.php?tid=7202)
من هم السبعين نفسا الخارجين من صلب يعقوب؟ - وائل انور - 01-18-2008
fancyhoney
Arrayفهل قرأته مردودا عليه ام قرأته بلا رد ؟[/quote]
اولا:-
لم اقرا ردا على اسئلتى
ثانيا:-
حتى لو كان مردود عليه فلا يوجد اى حاله من الحواربل وضع رد سولء غلط صح مافى محاكمه على كلامه وهنا دور قسم الحوار الدينى لمناقشه الرد ان كان صحيح ام خطا
وللملاحظه:-
ان كان لديك ردا اتفضل قوله ونتاقش فيه فى مداخلتك القادمه ان شاء الله
فارجو ذلك
شكرا
من هم السبعين نفسا الخارجين من صلب يعقوب؟ - fancyhoney - 01-18-2008
Arrayهنا دور قسم الحوار الدينى لمناقشه الرد ان كان صحيح ام خطا
[/quote]
فما رايك ان تضع هنا في قسم الحوار الديني الرد الذي ( اخفيته ) ثم تضع اعتراضاتك عليه !
من هم السبعين نفسا الخارجين من صلب يعقوب؟ - وائل انور - 01-18-2008
fancyhoney
قلت لم اجد ردا على اسئلتى فانى لااخفى شيئا
منتظرك
من هم السبعين نفسا الخارجين من صلب يعقوب؟ - fancyhoney - 01-18-2008
1- اين قرأت السؤال اذن ؟
2- ما رأيك بكذا ردا
Array
A table given by Scheuchzer, extracted from the Memoires de Trevoux,
gives the following general view: The twelve sons of JACOB with their
children and grandchildren.
Reuben and his four sons 5
Simeon and his six sons 7
Levi and his three sons 4
Judah and his seven sons and grandsons 8
Issachar and his four sons 5
Zebulun and his three sons 4
Total sons of JACOB and LEAH 33
Gad and his seven sons 8
Asher and his seven sons and grandsons 8
Total sons of JACOB and ZILPAH 16
Joseph and his two sons 3
Benjamin and his ten sons 11
Total sons of JACOB and RACHEL 14
Dan and his son 2
Naphtali and his four sons 5
Total sons of JACOB and BILHAH 7
Total sons of Jacob and his four wives 70
“To harmonize this with the Septuagint and St. Stephen, <440714>Acts
7:14, to the number sixty-six (all the souls that came out of Jacob’s
loins, <014626>Genesis 46:26) add nine of the patriarchs’ wives, Judah’s
wife being already dead in Canaan, (<013812>Genesis 38:12,) Benjamin
being supposed to be as yet unmarried, and the wife of Joseph
being already in Egypt, and therefore out of the case: the number
will amount to seventy-five, which is that found in the
Acts.”-Universal History.
Dr. Hales’ method is more simple, and I think more satisfactory: “Moses
states that all the souls that came with Jacob into Egypt which issued
from his loins, (except his sons wives,) were sixty-six souls, <014626>Genesis
46:26; and this number is thus collected:
JACOB’S children, eleven sons and one daughter 12
Reuben’s sons 4
Simeon’s sons 6
Levi’s sons 3
Judah’s three sons and two grandsons 5
Issachar’s sons 4
Zebulun’s sons 3
Gad’s sons 7
Asher’s four sons, one daughter, and two grandsons 7
Dan’s son 1
Naphtali’s sons 4
Benjamin’s sons 10
66
“If to these sixty-six children, and grandchildren, and great
grandchildren, we add Jacob himself, Joseph and his two sons, the
amount is seventy, the whole amount of Jacob’s family which
settled in Egypt.
“In this statement the wives of Jacob’s sons, who formed part of
the household, are omitted; but they amounted to nine, for of the
twelve wives of the twelve sons of Jacob, Judah’s wife was dead,
<013812>Genesis 38:12, and Simeon’s also, as we may collect from his
youngest son Shaul by a Canannitess, <014610>Genesis 46:10, and
Joseph’s wife was already in Egypt. These nine wives, therefore,
added to the sixty-six, give seventy-five souls the whole amount of
Jacob’s household that went down with him to Egypt; critically
corresponding with the statement in the New Testament, that
‘Joseph sent for his father Jacob and all his kindred, amounting to
seventy-five souls.’ The expression all his kindred, including the
wives which were Joseph’s kindred, not only by affinity, but also
by consanguinity, being probably of the families of Esau, Ishmael,
or Keturah. Thus does the New Testament furnish an admirable
comment on the Old.”-Analysis, vol. ii., p. 159.
It is necessary to observe that this statement, which appears on the whole
the most consistent, supposes that Judah was married when about
fourteen years of age, his son Er at the same age, Pharez at the same,
Asher and his fourth son Beriah under twenty, Benjamin about fifteen, and
Joseph’s sons and grandsons about twenty. But this is not improbable, as
the children of Israel must all have married at a very early age, to have
produced in about two hundred and fifteen years no less than six hundred
thousand persons above twenty years old, besides women and children.
[/quote]
gives the following general view: The twelve sons of JACOB with their
children and grandchildren.
Reuben and his four sons 5
Simeon and his six sons 7
Levi and his three sons 4
Judah and his seven sons and grandsons 8
Issachar and his four sons 5
Zebulun and his three sons 4
Total sons of JACOB and LEAH 33
Gad and his seven sons 8
Asher and his seven sons and grandsons 8
Total sons of JACOB and ZILPAH 16
Joseph and his two sons 3
Benjamin and his ten sons 11
Total sons of JACOB and RACHEL 14
Dan and his son 2
Naphtali and his four sons 5
Total sons of JACOB and BILHAH 7
Total sons of Jacob and his four wives 70
“To harmonize this with the Septuagint and St. Stephen, <440714>Acts
7:14, to the number sixty-six (all the souls that came out of Jacob’s
loins, <014626>Genesis 46:26) add nine of the patriarchs’ wives, Judah’s
wife being already dead in Canaan, (<013812>Genesis 38:12,) Benjamin
being supposed to be as yet unmarried, and the wife of Joseph
being already in Egypt, and therefore out of the case: the number
will amount to seventy-five, which is that found in the
Acts.”-Universal History.
Dr. Hales’ method is more simple, and I think more satisfactory: “Moses
states that all the souls that came with Jacob into Egypt which issued
from his loins, (except his sons wives,) were sixty-six souls, <014626>Genesis
46:26; and this number is thus collected:
JACOB’S children, eleven sons and one daughter 12
Reuben’s sons 4
Simeon’s sons 6
Levi’s sons 3
Judah’s three sons and two grandsons 5
Issachar’s sons 4
Zebulun’s sons 3
Gad’s sons 7
Asher’s four sons, one daughter, and two grandsons 7
Dan’s son 1
Naphtali’s sons 4
Benjamin’s sons 10
66
“If to these sixty-six children, and grandchildren, and great
grandchildren, we add Jacob himself, Joseph and his two sons, the
amount is seventy, the whole amount of Jacob’s family which
settled in Egypt.
“In this statement the wives of Jacob’s sons, who formed part of
the household, are omitted; but they amounted to nine, for of the
twelve wives of the twelve sons of Jacob, Judah’s wife was dead,
<013812>Genesis 38:12, and Simeon’s also, as we may collect from his
youngest son Shaul by a Canannitess, <014610>Genesis 46:10, and
Joseph’s wife was already in Egypt. These nine wives, therefore,
added to the sixty-six, give seventy-five souls the whole amount of
Jacob’s household that went down with him to Egypt; critically
corresponding with the statement in the New Testament, that
‘Joseph sent for his father Jacob and all his kindred, amounting to
seventy-five souls.’ The expression all his kindred, including the
wives which were Joseph’s kindred, not only by affinity, but also
by consanguinity, being probably of the families of Esau, Ishmael,
or Keturah. Thus does the New Testament furnish an admirable
comment on the Old.”-Analysis, vol. ii., p. 159.
It is necessary to observe that this statement, which appears on the whole
the most consistent, supposes that Judah was married when about
fourteen years of age, his son Er at the same age, Pharez at the same,
Asher and his fourth son Beriah under twenty, Benjamin about fifteen, and
Joseph’s sons and grandsons about twenty. But this is not improbable, as
the children of Israel must all have married at a very early age, to have
produced in about two hundred and fifteen years no less than six hundred
thousand persons above twenty years old, besides women and children.
من هم السبعين نفسا الخارجين من صلب يعقوب؟ - fancyhoney - 01-18-2008
1- اين قرأت السؤال اذن ؟
2- ما رأيك بكذا ردا
Array
A table given by Scheuchzer, extracted from the Memoires de Trevoux,
gives the following general view: The twelve sons of JACOB with their
children and grandchildren.
Reuben and his four sons 5
Simeon and his six sons 7
Levi and his three sons 4
Judah and his seven sons and grandsons 8
Issachar and his four sons 5
Zebulun and his three sons 4
Total sons of JACOB and LEAH 33
Gad and his seven sons 8
Asher and his seven sons and grandsons 8
Total sons of JACOB and ZILPAH 16
Joseph and his two sons 3
Benjamin and his ten sons 11
Total sons of JACOB and RACHEL 14
Dan and his son 2
Naphtali and his four sons 5
Total sons of JACOB and BILHAH 7
Total sons of Jacob and his four wives 70
“To harmonize this with the Septuagint and St. Stephen, <440714>Acts
7:14, to the number sixty-six (all the souls that came out of Jacob’s
loins, <014626>Genesis 46:26) add nine of the patriarchs’ wives, Judah’s
wife being already dead in Canaan, (<013812>Genesis 38:12,) Benjamin
being supposed to be as yet unmarried, and the wife of Joseph
being already in Egypt, and therefore out of the case: the number
will amount to seventy-five, which is that found in the
Acts.”-Universal History.
Dr. Hales’ method is more simple, and I think more satisfactory: “Moses
states that all the souls that came with Jacob into Egypt which issued
from his loins, (except his sons wives,) were sixty-six souls, <014626>Genesis
46:26; and this number is thus collected:
JACOB’S children, eleven sons and one daughter 12
Reuben’s sons 4
Simeon’s sons 6
Levi’s sons 3
Judah’s three sons and two grandsons 5
Issachar’s sons 4
Zebulun’s sons 3
Gad’s sons 7
Asher’s four sons, one daughter, and two grandsons 7
Dan’s son 1
Naphtali’s sons 4
Benjamin’s sons 10
66
“If to these sixty-six children, and grandchildren, and great
grandchildren, we add Jacob himself, Joseph and his two sons, the
amount is seventy, the whole amount of Jacob’s family which
settled in Egypt.
“In this statement the wives of Jacob’s sons, who formed part of
the household, are omitted; but they amounted to nine, for of the
twelve wives of the twelve sons of Jacob, Judah’s wife was dead,
<013812>Genesis 38:12, and Simeon’s also, as we may collect from his
youngest son Shaul by a Canannitess, <014610>Genesis 46:10, and
Joseph’s wife was already in Egypt. These nine wives, therefore,
added to the sixty-six, give seventy-five souls the whole amount of
Jacob’s household that went down with him to Egypt; critically
corresponding with the statement in the New Testament, that
‘Joseph sent for his father Jacob and all his kindred, amounting to
seventy-five souls.’ The expression all his kindred, including the
wives which were Joseph’s kindred, not only by affinity, but also
by consanguinity, being probably of the families of Esau, Ishmael,
or Keturah. Thus does the New Testament furnish an admirable
comment on the Old.”-Analysis, vol. ii., p. 159.
It is necessary to observe that this statement, which appears on the whole
the most consistent, supposes that Judah was married when about
fourteen years of age, his son Er at the same age, Pharez at the same,
Asher and his fourth son Beriah under twenty, Benjamin about fifteen, and
Joseph’s sons and grandsons about twenty. But this is not improbable, as
the children of Israel must all have married at a very early age, to have
produced in about two hundred and fifteen years no less than six hundred
thousand persons above twenty years old, besides women and children.
[/quote]
gives the following general view: The twelve sons of JACOB with their
children and grandchildren.
Reuben and his four sons 5
Simeon and his six sons 7
Levi and his three sons 4
Judah and his seven sons and grandsons 8
Issachar and his four sons 5
Zebulun and his three sons 4
Total sons of JACOB and LEAH 33
Gad and his seven sons 8
Asher and his seven sons and grandsons 8
Total sons of JACOB and ZILPAH 16
Joseph and his two sons 3
Benjamin and his ten sons 11
Total sons of JACOB and RACHEL 14
Dan and his son 2
Naphtali and his four sons 5
Total sons of JACOB and BILHAH 7
Total sons of Jacob and his four wives 70
“To harmonize this with the Septuagint and St. Stephen, <440714>Acts
7:14, to the number sixty-six (all the souls that came out of Jacob’s
loins, <014626>Genesis 46:26) add nine of the patriarchs’ wives, Judah’s
wife being already dead in Canaan, (<013812>Genesis 38:12,) Benjamin
being supposed to be as yet unmarried, and the wife of Joseph
being already in Egypt, and therefore out of the case: the number
will amount to seventy-five, which is that found in the
Acts.”-Universal History.
Dr. Hales’ method is more simple, and I think more satisfactory: “Moses
states that all the souls that came with Jacob into Egypt which issued
from his loins, (except his sons wives,) were sixty-six souls, <014626>Genesis
46:26; and this number is thus collected:
JACOB’S children, eleven sons and one daughter 12
Reuben’s sons 4
Simeon’s sons 6
Levi’s sons 3
Judah’s three sons and two grandsons 5
Issachar’s sons 4
Zebulun’s sons 3
Gad’s sons 7
Asher’s four sons, one daughter, and two grandsons 7
Dan’s son 1
Naphtali’s sons 4
Benjamin’s sons 10
66
“If to these sixty-six children, and grandchildren, and great
grandchildren, we add Jacob himself, Joseph and his two sons, the
amount is seventy, the whole amount of Jacob’s family which
settled in Egypt.
“In this statement the wives of Jacob’s sons, who formed part of
the household, are omitted; but they amounted to nine, for of the
twelve wives of the twelve sons of Jacob, Judah’s wife was dead,
<013812>Genesis 38:12, and Simeon’s also, as we may collect from his
youngest son Shaul by a Canannitess, <014610>Genesis 46:10, and
Joseph’s wife was already in Egypt. These nine wives, therefore,
added to the sixty-six, give seventy-five souls the whole amount of
Jacob’s household that went down with him to Egypt; critically
corresponding with the statement in the New Testament, that
‘Joseph sent for his father Jacob and all his kindred, amounting to
seventy-five souls.’ The expression all his kindred, including the
wives which were Joseph’s kindred, not only by affinity, but also
by consanguinity, being probably of the families of Esau, Ishmael,
or Keturah. Thus does the New Testament furnish an admirable
comment on the Old.”-Analysis, vol. ii., p. 159.
It is necessary to observe that this statement, which appears on the whole
the most consistent, supposes that Judah was married when about
fourteen years of age, his son Er at the same age, Pharez at the same,
Asher and his fourth son Beriah under twenty, Benjamin about fifteen, and
Joseph’s sons and grandsons about twenty. But this is not improbable, as
the children of Israel must all have married at a very early age, to have
produced in about two hundred and fifteen years no less than six hundred
thousand persons above twenty years old, besides women and children.
من هم السبعين نفسا الخارجين من صلب يعقوب؟ - وائل انور - 01-18-2008
fancyhoney
Array2- ما رأيك بكذا ردا[/quote]
طيب ....
طلعلى اجابه هذا السؤال من الكذا رد اللى انتا وضعتهم كدا:-
سفر الخروج-الاصحاح15
وكان مَجْموعُ الْنَّفوسِ الخارجةِ مِن صُلْبِ يَعْقوبَ سبعين نفسا
الرقم سبعين فى هذا النص مضاف اليه يعقوب ام لا؟
طلعلى اجابه هذا السؤال من الكذا رد اللى وضعتهم:-
الترجمه الانجليزيه للترجمه السبعينيه
46:27 And the sons of Joseph, who were born to him in the land of Egypt, were nine souls; all the souls of the house of Jacob who came with Joseph into Egypt, were seventy-five souls
الترجمه الانجليزيه للنص العبرى لنفس النص السابق
46:27 And the sons of Joseph, which were born him in Egypt, were two souls: all the souls of the house of Jacob, which came into Egypt, were threescore and ten
[color=red]هل اخطات الترجمه السبعينيه عندما جعلت عدد ابناء يوسف تسعه وهما خمسه فقط؟وهل هناك هدف من تغير الرقم؟
ملحوظه:-
ولا رد من انتا جبتهم بيرد على اسئلتى ان وجدت فانا منتظرك
من هم السبعين نفسا الخارجين من صلب يعقوب؟ - fancyhoney - 01-18-2008
هل يمكنك قراءة الانكليزية ؟
لان الرد حدد الاسماء بتفاصيلها
و تكلم عن السبعينية ايضا !
من هم السبعين نفسا الخارجين من صلب يعقوب؟ - وائل انور - 01-18-2008
Arrayهل يمكنك قراءة الانجليزية ؟[/quote]
الحمد لله على اقد ما اقدر ولو ما عرفتش فى قواميس للترجمه النصوص مش مشكله يعنى
Arrayلان الرد حدد الاسماء بتفاصيلها[/quote]
هو علشان حدد الاسماء يبقى اتجاوب عليا .شوف سؤالى انا بقول فيه ايه
ياترى قال ان يعقوب محسوب فى نص سفر الخروج ولا لا؟
ارنى اين هو؟
Arrayو تكلم عن السبعينية ايضا ![/quote]
ياترى قال :-
لماذا جعلت السبعينيه عدد ابناء يوسف تسعه وهما خمسه فقط فى حين ان النص العبرى لنفس النص الموجود فى السبعينيه قال اتنين؟؟؟
ارنى اين هو
منتظرك
من هم السبعين نفسا الخارجين من صلب يعقوب؟ - fancyhoney - 01-18-2008
Array
الحمد لله على اقد ما اقدر ولو ما عرفتش فى قواميس للترجمه النصوص مش مشكله يعنى
هو علشان حدد الاسماء يبقى اتجاوب عليا .شوف سؤالى انا بقول فيه ايه
ياترى قال ان يعقوب محسوب فى نص سفر الخروج ولا لا؟
[/quote]
تحتاج هنا الي معرفة الانكليزية , و معرفة الحساب
لأنه اعطى الاسماء و حسابها
فابحث عن يعقوب بين الاسماء
ان وجدته فهو هو
امازلت تعتقد ان سؤالك بعيد عن الاجابة ؟
Arrayلماذا جعلت السبعينيه عدد ابناء يوسف تسعه وهما خمسه فقط فى حين ان النص العبرى لنفس النص الموجود فى السبعينيه قال اتنين؟؟؟
ارنى اين هو [/quote]
ابناء يوسف ( اثنان \ خمسة \ تسعة ) ؟
ما رأيك انت ؟
و لم اخترت هذا الرأي ؟
من هم السبعين نفسا الخارجين من صلب يعقوب؟ - وائل انور - 01-18-2008
Arrayامازلت تعتقد ان سؤالك بعيد عن الاجابة ؟[/quote]
يعقوب محسوب ولا مش محسوب فى نص سفر الخروج؟؟
Arrayابناء يوسف ( اثنان \ خمسة \ تسعة ) ؟
ما رأيك انت ؟
و لم اخترت هذا الرأي ؟[/quote]
النص العبرى قال اتنين
والترجمه السبعينيه قال تسعه
فانا اللى بسالك عدد ابناء يوسف اللى تم ذكرهم خمسه فقط فى الترجمه السبعينيه من اين اتت بتسعه ام اخطات؟
منتظرك