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Warning [2] Undefined variable $newpmmsg - Line: 24 - File: global.php(958) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/global.php 958 eval
/showthread.php 28 require_once
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/global.php 961 eval
/showthread.php 28 require_once
Warning [2] Undefined variable $board_messages - Line: 28 - File: global.php(961) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined property: MyLanguage::$bottomlinks_returncontent - Line: 6 - File: global.php(1070) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
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/inc/functions.php 3442 eval
/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
Warning [2] Undefined property: MyLanguage::$forumjump_select - Line: 5 - File: inc/functions.php(3442) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/functions.php 3442 eval
/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code 2 errorHandler->error_callback
/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1686) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1686 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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النواصب والتشيع الاثني عشري والسياسة
الإبستمولوجي مبتعد
عضو متقدم
****

المشاركات: 506
الانضمام: Jul 2010
مشاركة: #19
الرد على: النواصب والتشيع الاثني عشري والسياسة
صاحب الردّ أعلاه : من أنبأك أنني أتحرّق شوقا لنقاش معك ؟ أو أنني سأقضي بقية عمري لطما بسبب إعراضك عني ؟
لا محاباة إذا ما تعلق الأمر بجانب العقيدة ؛ وعندما أناقش لاتهمني لا أنت ولا ملء الأرض من أمثالك.
أكتب لأعرض وجهة نظري ؛ لا لأعجبك فلست هنا في برايمات اكس فاكتور أو شيعة آيدول ؛ ولا في برنامج "ما يطلبه المشاهدون" لأغني لك ما تهوى نفسك.
الله حاور الشيطان ؛ والرسول جادل من هم اشد عداوة له ؛ وفي الحالتين لم يقع تحجّج بمثل الحماقات التي تسوقها.
هذا ابتداءً

أمّا ثانيا : فإن وجود "مشتركات" بين عقيدتين لا يجعلهما دينا واحدا . سيما إن كان الخلاف حول أصل الدين ذاته.
طائفة الأحمدية أو القاديانية ؛ أوليست هي طائفة تدعي الإنتماء إلى الإسلام وتدعي الإيمان بالله وبمحمّد وتلتقي مع عقائد السنة والشيعة في "مشتركات" ؟ أتحداك إن كنتَ مع هذا تعتبرها "مذهبا" إسلاميا رغم تلك "المشتركات" !!
(مراجعكم يفتون بكفر القاديانية وكتبكم تقول بكفر النصيرية رغم كونهم شيعة إمامية)

الخلاف بين أهل السّنة وبين الشيعة خلاف يتجاوز فروع الدين ومذاهب فهمه إلى الخلاف حول أصول الدين ومصادره رأساً ؛ لذلك يجعل عقيدة الشيعة مستقلة كليا ؛ بالتبع هي "دين" مستقل وليست "مذهب" يختلف فقط مع دين أهل السنة والجماعة والذي هو الإسلام ؛
ولنوضح - لغيرك- دواعي هذه النتيجة :
- أركان الإسلام عند أهل السنة والجماعة هي غير أركان الإسلام عند الشيعة ؛ فـ "الإمامة" عند الشيعة هي ركن ركين يترتب على الإيمان به جنة أو نار ؛ وعلى ذلك دلت كتبكم ؛ رغم أن الخلاف حول الإمامة لم ينشأ إلا بعد وفاة الرسول ؛ أمّا عند أهل السنة فلا وجود لعقيدة الإمامة.
- مصادر الدين عند أهل السنة والجماعة هما مصدران أساسيان فقط : الكتاب والسنة ؛ أمّا عند الشيعة الإمامية فمصادر الدين بتعداد الأئمة وأهل الكساء ؛ فيصير بذلك عند الشيعة 15 مصدرا للدين وعقائده وتشريعاته كلها متساوية. وبناء على ما تقدّم فإن مصادر الوحي عند أهل السنة انقطعت بانتقال النبي إلى الرفيق الأعلى ؛ أمّا عند الشيعة فمن خصائص الإمام هو العِلم الموروث عن النبي ( الوحي ) يتلقاه من الله وبما ورثه الأئمة عن جدّهم النبي - بزعمكم - لذلك فالإمام عندكم يعلم الغيب ؛ بل يعلم حتى مافي أرحام الأمهات ويعلم متى يموت ؛ فإذا أضفنا إلى ما تقدّم عقيدة "الغيبة" الملازمة للإمام الثاني عشر تبيّن أن العلم الموروث ( الوحي ) لم ينقطع إلى يومنا هذا كون إمامكم الـ 12 ( الذي يعلم الغيب والذي ورث الوحي عن النبي ) هو حيّ يُرزق ؛ وكل ما في الأمر هو احتجاب "الموحى إليه" ؛ بما يترتب عن هذه العقيدة الخطيرة القائلة باستمرار الوحي إلى يومن هذا من إمكانية نسخ الشريعة المحمّدية كون حجيّة قول الإمام عندكم تعادل حجيّة قول النبي الأكرم وحجية القرآن ذاته.
-القرآن عند أهل السنة معصوم من التحريف ( ما تروّجونه من وجود التحريف عند أهل السنة لا يتجاوز بعض الشذوذ أو القراءات الشاذة للناسخ والمنسوخ ) ؛ أمّا القرآن عندكم فهو غير القرآن عند أهل السنة والجماعة ؛ كون القرآن في عقيتكم قد طاله التحريف وحُذفت منه أسماء الأئمة؛ وأول من جمع القرآن عندكم هو عليّ بن أبي طالب الذي عرضه على الصحابة فرفضوه فتوعدهم أن لا يروه إلا يقوم قائمكم ؛ لذلك فالقرآن عندكم هو إمّا محرّف أو ناقص - على فرض انتفاء عقيدة التحريف - لذلك لا توجد عندكم فتوى صريحة وواضحة بتكفير معتقد تحريف القرآن كما هي عند أهل السنة كون رؤوس كبار من شيوخ طائفتكم يقولون بعقيدة التحريف.
- كتب الأحاديث المعتمدة عند أهل السنة والجماعة غير كتبكم ؛ فلأهل السنة صحاحهم ولكم كافيكم وإستبصاركم ومالايحضره فقيهكم وغيرها ؛ وهذا يعني عدم الإجتماع أصلا حول أصل أصيل من أصول الدين وهي "السنة النبوية" فلأهل السنة والجماعة سنتهم وأحاديثهم ولكم أحاديثكم ؛ لا تلتقون معهم حتى في أقوال النبي المبلغ عن الله ؛ ورواة الحديث من أهل السنة والجماعة عندكم هم شلة "كذبة" و"مدلسين" (ابوهريرة والبخاري نموذجا) ؛ ورواتكم عند أهل السنة هم "مبتدعة" لا تجوز الرواية عنهم في شؤون بدعتهم.
أضف إلى ما تقدم أن لقول الإمام عندكم حجية تعادل حجية قول الله سبحانه ؛ فلا يمكن لك ردّ قول الإمام ولو فعلت لصرتَ كافرا ؛ أمّا عند السني فيمكنه أن يضرب بقول إمامك عرض الحائط ولا كرامة سيما إن كان من غير المشهود لهم بالعلم والورع ( الإمام الهادي مثالا ) ؛ وقد يكون شعر أحمد شوقي عند السني أفضل من قول إمامك لأن أغلب أئمتكم ليسوا إلا من السلف الصالح لا حجية لأقوالهم ولا بطيخ ولا منجا.
هذه بعض النقاط الوجيزة - وليس كلها - حول الخلاف حول أصول الدين : خلاف حول صحة القرآن .. حول مصادر الحديث ..حول مركزية "الإمام" ..حول مصادر الوحي ..حول الإمامة .. وكلها ليست قضايا فرعية الخ
أمّا الخلاف في فروع الدين فقائم أيضا .. فلا أذان أهل السنة هو أذانكم ؛ ولا وضوء أهل السنة هو وضوءكم ولا مواقيت أهل السنة هي مواقيتكم.
فقل لي بالله عليك : مالذي يجمع عقييدتكم بعقيدة أهل السنة والجماعة ؟ حتى يصير الخلاف فيها هو "مذهب" لا يطال "الأصول"

باقي كلامك هراء .. لا محلّ له .. فلم أتحدث عن "التعايش" حتى تحدثني عن الناس التي " تتعامل مع بعضها بشكل طبيعي بدون حساسية وعدوانية، ولاتسأل ماهودين الرجل أومذهبه" وتشرب مع بعضها بيبسي على جسر الأئمة أو غازلوا عيون المها بين الرصافة والجسر.
حتى اليهود في المغرب وفي تونس وفي اليمن هم متعايشون مع المسلمين هناك ... من أثار مسألة التعايش أصلا ؟؟؟

أقول كلمتي وأمشي .. ولا يهمني أن تعقب من عدمه.
(تم إجراء آخر تعديل على هذه المشاركة: 03-29-2013, 12:57 AM بواسطة الإبستمولوجي.)
03-29-2013, 12:16 AM
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الرد على: النواصب والتشيع الاثني عشري والسياسة - بواسطة الإبستمولوجي - 03-29-2013, 12:16 AM

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