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/global.php 958 eval
/showthread.php 28 require_once
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/global.php 961 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined property: MyLanguage::$bottomlinks_returncontent - Line: 6 - File: global.php(1070) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
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/inc/functions.php 3442 eval
/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
Warning [2] Undefined property: MyLanguage::$forumjump_select - Line: 5 - File: inc/functions.php(3442) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/functions.php 3442 eval
/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code 2 errorHandler->error_callback
/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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لقاء وحوار مع زعيم المنتدى (الزعيم رقم صفر)
الزعيم رقم صفر غير متصل
الميت أصلا
*****

المشاركات: 4,354
الانضمام: Dec 2004
مشاركة: #85
لقاء وحوار مع زعيم المنتدى (الزعيم رقم صفر)
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لت : إنك قرأت ودعمت إيمانك بالإسلام من خلال المطالعة ، والمقارنة بينه وبين غيره ، وخاصة (المسيحية) لُعبة المسلم ، ووصلت إلى (يقين!) أن الإسلام (صواب) وما عداه باطلاً ، والمقصود بالأخص (المسيحية) ، هي إذًا رحلة فكر وعقل باحث ؟! أم مسبوقة بخلفية أن الإسلام هو الصواب ، فمستحيل أن يكون أبي وأمي على ضلال ، ولندعم هذا الذي ورثناه ؟!
لماذا المسيحية وحدها ، هي معيار المقارنة إلى جانب الإسلام ؟ لِمَ لا تكون البوذية مثلا أو اليهودية ؟ ربما يكون العامل الرئيس ما ذكرته حضرتك من اختلاطك الأول ، بمسيحي يبشر بها على المذهب الذي ذكرت ، أو ربما لشيوع المقارنة هذه على الشبكة هنا وذيوعها ، والإنسان رهن بالبيئة المحيطة به يتأثر بها ، وينظر من خلالها ، ويكون خبراتها على أساس ما تمنحه ظروفها ..
كيف كانت قراءتك أخي في المسيحية مثلا ؟

[/quote]

مرحبا بالاستاذ يجعله عامر

يا استاذنا لم اقل ان دليل صحة الاسلام هو خطا المسيحيه و لم استدل بالمسيحيه على صحة الاسلام

فالاسلام عندما نزل على سيدنا رسول الله كان فى بيئه ليست مسيحيه على الاخص و لكن كانت المسيحيه موجوده

و فى الاصل اهتمامى بالمسيحيه لا يتعدى واحد بالمائه من اهتمامى بالاسلام
و حتى ما يوجد لدى من كتب مسيحيه لا يتعدى ثلاثه و هى الكتاب المقدس و العهد الجديد و علم اللاهوت النظامى للقس جيمس انس فى مقابل ما لا يقل عن مائة كتاب اسلامى و لم اقرا مخططات و لا قارنتها و لا يحزنون لان عور المسيحيه واضح و بين من الكتاب المقدس و العوده الى المخطوطات الغرض منها بيان سبب العور فى نسخ الكتاب المقدس

و بعدين حجة اننا ولدنا مسلمين فلابد ان نتعصب للاسلام مردود عليها بان هناك من يولد على الاسلام و يتركه و هناك من يولد على غير الاسلام و يعتنقه

و بعدين هو احنا بنتكلم فى الاسلامن من خارج نصوص الاسلام الصحيحه ؟ يعنى حتى لو كان الموضوع تعصب فالنص سوف يعرى هذا التعصب

و قبل هذا و ذاك فان المسيحيه ساقطه كفكره دون الحاجه للكتاب و ما تلك المبررات و هذه الفلسفه الا سند للفكره المتهافته القائله بوراثة الخطيئه و ان الله لازم يعمل كذا و كذا و ان الله تجسد فى صورة ابنه فهذا الكلام سابق للكتاب و هو متهافت و يجعلك ترفض المسيحيه من الاصل بسهوله

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ممن ذكرتهم في جملة من تحبهم الأخ الأكبر(eeww2000) هل لنا أن نستأنس برأيه وأنت تقدره في بحوث الجدل والدفاع الموجودة على المشباك ؟


[/quote]


أستأنس برأيه فى ايه بالضبط ؟

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هل قرأت تفاسير النصوص بحسب وجهات القوم (المسيحيون) ومذاهبهم ، فربما (الأرثوزكس) لديهم الكثير من الخلل وقلة العلم ، لكنا لا نعدم طوائف غيرها ، تحسن الحديث عن دينها ، وتدون الكثير من الجدير أن يراعى حين المقارنة ...
(ملحوظة : ركزت على الأسئلة الخاصة بالمسيحية لربما يخجل أحد زملائنا المسيحيين من السؤال، وأنت تعرف أني مثلك مسلم وإن كنا على طرائق مختلفة يمضي كل منا)..


[/quote]

التفسير ملزم للمفسر و اتباعه اما نصوص الكتاب فهى ملزمه للجميع

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من خلال قراءتي لبداية رحلة حياتك -مد الله في عمرك بالإنجازات وحقق لك ما تبغي- أرى البداية تتشابه مع كثيرين ، خاصة في مصر ..
أبدى الزميل بهاء إعجابه بما حققت -خاصة في بلد كمصر- لكني كنت أطمع أن أرى منك المزيد ، وربما غير ما أنت عليه ، ليس تدخلا في شأنك الخاص ، بقدر ما هو محبة ومراد لك ، ولأمثالي ، ولغيرنا من الشباب المصري ..

[/quote]

إنجازات ايه ؟ :teeth_smile:

انا انسان بسيط يا استاذ عامر و عادى زى باقى الناس و لا انجاز و لا شئ

و عند تخرجى فى الكليه كان عدد المهندسين فى مصر ثمانون الف مهندس

و انا لم احقق اى شئ مذهل يعنى كله عادى

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عن نفسي نشأت في بيئة ، لا يحسن إلا ان تُخرج للشارع إلا مجرما أو حمارا حمالا للعنب ، أو بقرة تعنى بأمر الساقية ، فجميل اني تعلمت القراءة والكتابة ، فهذا إنجاز جد كبير ، وحبذا لو قرن بأن يصرف الله شري عن غيري ، فتلك مرتبة عليا يصل إليها الفرد في بيئتي ، فلم ينشئ أحدهم وليده -عندنا- على النظر إلى الكتاب ، ولا الحديث بأدب ولا مراعاة بروتكولات (وإن كان بعضهم يحاول إلا ان البيئة تجرف الأغلب إلى مستنقعها)..
حضرتك نشأت في بيئة ممتازة جدا ، وربما أمثالي يحسدونك عليها (كون ميلادك لأبوين متعلمين) وكان أن صار تعليمك مشابه لهما (الهندسة) وتلك ميزة كبيرة ، فلعلك ورثت ما أورثوك إياه من علم ومعرفة بهذا التخصص إلى جانب ما تعلمته في دراستك ، فهل ترى أنك مثالا جيدا لشخص استثمر ما توافر من إمكانيات لديه ، ولم يقصر في ما منحه الله ، ويلتفت إلى طريق غيره ؟

[/quote]

هنا بقى يا استاذ عامر اهم نقطه فى مداخلتك و اكثر النقاط حساسيه

للعلم يا استاذ عامر فى كلية الهندسه كان هناك الكثير من الطلاب و الطالبات ( المتفوقين ) من بيوت لا يوجد بها من يقرا و لا يكتب

و كان من اصدقائى الصديق (ع) كان مسيحى من قريه تابعه لمركز جرجا - سوهاج و اهله فلاحين بسطاء جدا و منتهى الفقر و محدش بيعرف يقرا و لا يكتب و كان يسكن فى المدينه الجامعيه و كان يحرص على التفوق حتى لا يتم طرده من المدينه الجامعيه لجامعه القاهره و تحويله الى مدينه اخرى للطلبه فى امبابه تابعه لمحافظة القاهره

يعنى امية اهله لم تمنعه من التعلم و التفوق

و هو الان يعمل فى شركة توزيع كهرباء القاهره و على اتصال معى

و بالنسبه لسؤالك فى نهاية الاقتباس

قطعا لا فانا لم استغل ما تعوافر لدى من امكانيات و قد قصرت فى حق الله كثيرا و ربنا يغفر لى و يسامحنى


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بمعنى أوسع وأبين : هل ترى أنه مطلوب منك (كأساس) الانشغال بالدين الإسلامي ، والانشغال بعيوب النصارى ، وإظهار عوارهم ، حتى نستريح من شرهم ، ونبين صورة الإسلام الصحيح للحيارى والتائهين ، ونذب عن بيضة الإسلام ؟ أم تراه اهتماما يجاور اهتمامك بتخصصك ؟

[/quote]

اولا انا مش مهتم بالنصارى و لا حاططهم فى دماغى :teeth_smile: و هم فى مصر لا شر و لا حاجه بل هناك الكثير ممن يدعون الاسلام و هم فى الحقيقه الشر المتجسد و ربنا ينتقم منهم

انما النصارى عامة زيهم زينا عايشين فى البلد لهم نفس المشاكل و نفس المتاعب و عليهم نفس الضغوط فليس من الصحيح ان نفكر فى عيوب بعض و نتقاتل معا و نحن تحت هذا الضغط و حتى لو زال الضغط نعمل مشاكل مع بعض ليه ؟
إحنا كلنا مصريين و ظروفنا العامه متماثله

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وهل حققت نجاحا في تخصصك (الهندسة) ينفعني كمسلم ، أو مصري ، ويفيدني ، كما تفيد حضرتك المسلمين أو القراء على الإنترنات بتصويب أو بتوضيح صورة أو بإظهار عيوب مهاجم الإسلام من المسيحيين أو النصارى ؟

[/quote]

لا لم احقق

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لماذا أسأل هذا السؤال ؟
هل أتيت لكي أشوه صورة أو أشتت موضوعا [علم الله أنه ليس مقصدي] ولكنه سؤال يؤرقني ، لماذا لا يلتفت الطبيب -المصري خاصة ، لأن تجربتي المعاشية وخبراتي لا تتعدى القطر المصري-والمهندس وكل صاحب تخصص إلى تخصصه ، يبرع فيه أولا ، وليفعل ما يفعل بعدها من اهتمامات أخرى ، كدعوة الغير ، او مساعدته ؟

[/quote]

يا استاذ عامر

لا يوجد مجال لما تقول و لا يوجد تشجيع و الامر ليس بتلك السهوله و مين قالك انى مثلا لا اود ان ارتفع بمستوى العلم اللى عندى و استغله احسن استغلال و لكن للاسف لا يوجد مجال

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قلت حضرتك عن الزميل العاقل

لك الحرية أخي أن ترى ما رأيت ، وتعليقي ليس على الأوصاف التي وصفت حضرتك ، بل أعلق على ما يمكن أن أوجهه بنفس النص إليك (الكلام الملون بالأحمر)، هل ترى أنه يحق لك الدخول فيما تدخل ، ولا يحق للعاقل ؟ على أي أساس يمكننا تحديد أن فلان له في هذا ، وفلان ليس له ؟
بعيدا عن العاقل وشخصه ، من خلال حديثي معه ، ومع الزميل سيتا ، وكلاهما ، لا يتحدثان كثيرا ، وإن كان الفاضل الأخير يصدق عليه هذا أكثر ، رأيت في حديثهم وعيا بالتراث الإسلامي لم أره عند كثيرين مما يتحدثون باسم التراث او شيخنا والعلامة ! ربما كونت رأيي من خلال معارف بسيطة ، لكني وجدتني منساقا لقوله ..

[/quote]

هنا كل واحد يقل ما يريد و يتدخل فيما يريد و لا مانع و ما قلته لم يكن حجرا على العاقل بل راى فيما يفعل دون حجر و لا تدخل و لا منع ...هو حر

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نقطة أخرى :
حضرتك وجدت شخصا مثل (س) من الناس ، مسلم ، متعلم مثل بقية المتعلمين ، ورث الإسلام كغيره ، تاه مع التائهين وتخبط ، بل وشككه غيره (مسيحي) في دينه ، وأتاك الشخص على هذه الصورة ، بماذا تنصحه ؟
هل يقرأ ويتعلم عن دينه أكثر ؟
وماذا يقرأ ؟ بالنسبة لي هذا السؤال أهتم بإجابة حضرتك عليه ..

[/quote]

طبعا يقرا و يتعلم عن دينه اكثر و اكثر

و العلم الاسلامى علم جذاب و متنوع و خالى من الملل و ممتع جدا و بقدر ما تقرا فيه تنجذب اكثر و يزداد يقينك و تعلم و تفهم يعنى ايه ان الاسلام دين صح

أهم و أول ما يقرأه هو العقيده فهى اساس الاسلام

و انصحه بكتاب شرح العقيده الواسطيه لابن العثيمين (((( هام جدا )))) و هو يتناول شرح لما قاله ابن تيميه لرجل من قضاة واسط يشكو اليه الانحراف العقيدى

و اهمية الكتاب انه كله مدعم بالنصوص من القران بصفه اساسيه ثم الحديث الصحيح و لا يوجد فيه اى كلام من الدماغ و لا افتاءات و لا اراء خاصه كل كلمه مدعمه بايه او حديث صحيح فتشعر بالثقه فى الكتاب و انت تقرا

و هذا الكتاب متوفر فى مصر و زهيد الثمن بسبب توافره

و مستعد ارسل لك عشر نسخ على حسابى لو عاوز مفيش مشكله

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الأخ المهندس ، حضرتك قلت أنك قرأت (تفاسير) ، هل ممكن أن تذكر أسماء التفاسير التي قرأت ؟ وبماذا أفدت منها ؟

[/quote]

شوف يا استاذ عامر

قبل قراءة التفاسير يجب القول ان القران عربى و العربى مفهوم و منطوق
و ما يسمى تفاسير هى تسميه غير دقيقه بل الافضل نسميها كما سماها مولانا الشعراوى خواطر و هو الادق
و اهميتها انها تساعدنا نحن العوام على استخلاص النتائج و المعانى التى يلزمها ربط بين الايات و بعضها و بين الايات و الحديث و توضيح ما لا نفهمه نتيجة الضعف فى اللغه العربيه

و كل تفسير له ما يميزه عن غيره فمثلا هناك تفسير الجلالين و هو تفسير مختصر جدا يهتم بتوضيح معانى الالفاظ فقط لا غير و هو ما افضله لانك تقدر تقول انه خالى من الفتاوى و اراء البشر

و هناك تفسير ابن كثير و هو الاشهر لقيامه بعمل توضيح للاحاديث المرتبطه بكل ايه و لكن يعيب عليه عدم التزامه بالحديث الصحيح و لكن به فوائد عديده و على الدارس وجوب التحقق من صدة الاحاديث

و فى رأى ان افضل ما تسمى تفاسير هو خواطر الشعراوى

Array

حضرتك قلت : أنك إلى جوار من تحبهم ، كمحمد حسان ، ووجدي غنيم ، تحب القراءة لابن تيمية ، لماذا ابن تيمية ؟ ألا يوجد قبله أو بعده علماء ، يقال : ما الليث إلا عدة خراف مهضومة ، سأعتبر-فرضا- أن ابن تيمية ليثا ، فمن أين صار الليث ليثا ؟
شاكرًا سعة صدرك ، وشاكرا هذه الفرصة للحوار معكم ، فائق الاحترام لكم ..

[/quote]

ابن تيميه كان حاد الذكاء بطريقه مذهله و قام بتوظيف ذكاءه فى دراسة الاسلام

و ظهر ذكاؤه هذا فى كيفية استنباط الاحكام بالاستناد الى الكتاب و السنه الصحيحه

كل كلامه بالكتاب و السنه الصحيحه

كلامه واضح دون تحور و لا تكلف

اشهر من رد على المعتزله و الصوفيه و الشيعه و الملاحده مع عدم مساوتهم ببعض فالثلاثه الاوائل مسلمين و الاخيره لا

و له اقوى مؤلف اسلامى على الاطلاق و هو درء تعارض العقل و النقل و هذا الكتاب بحق هو انسب الكتب فى وقت الفتن مثل ما نحن فيه الان

و معنى العنوان هو درء التعارض بين النصوص الاسلاميه الصحيحه و بين العقل و الحقيقه انى لم اقدر على قراءة اكثر من جزء واحد من خمسة اجزاء لان الكلام و الكتاب صعب جدا بس مهم

و شكرا لك استاذ عامر

و تحت امرك
09-30-2008, 07:28 AM
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