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/global.php 958 eval
/showthread.php 28 require_once
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/global.php 961 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined property: MyLanguage::$bottomlinks_returncontent - Line: 6 - File: global.php(1070) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
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/inc/functions.php 3442 eval
/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
Warning [2] Undefined property: MyLanguage::$forumjump_select - Line: 5 - File: inc/functions.php(3442) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/functions.php 3442 eval
/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code 2 errorHandler->error_callback
/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/functions_post.php 898 pluginSystem->run_hooks
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نادي الفكر العربي / الســــــــاحات العامـــــــة / فكـــر حــــر v / قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ...

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النظام الخطي
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ...
العلماني غير متصل
خدني على الأرض اللي ربّتني ...
*****

المشاركات: 4,079
الانضمام: Nov 2001
مشاركة: #122
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ...
Array
عزيزي العلماني

الا تراه تناقضا ان تضع شرطا مسبقا غير ديموقراطي يلغي اية امكانية لحرية الاختيار ( ماذا عن " الحرية " كشرط مسبق للديموقراطية ) ؟ العالم مليء بالتجارب الديموقراطية " الغير علمانية " . اعتقد إن طرح الامر بهذا الشكل يبرز الأمر الأهم هنا : وهو العداء لحركة حماس كحركة في أساسها " غير فتحاوية " , مع الاخذ بالحسبان انه لو أن الشعب الفلسطيني اختار " فتح " لكانت اراء الكثيرون هنا اصبحت فجأة " ديموقراطية ".

ملاحظة اخير : لا يأخذ بهذا الرأي أنني ابرر اعتقال الدكتور.
[/quote]

ليست هناك "ديمقراطيات حقيقية غير علمانية"، "فالعلمانية" (كحياد إيجابي للدولة) هي شرط أساسي لبلوغ "الديمقراطية الحقيقية"، وهذا بديهي يا "فرناس"(وما بتقدر تعمل "عجّه" بدون ما تكسر بيض). فمعنى ألا تكون الديمقراطية "علمانية" يعني بالضرورة أن يكون هناك "دين" للدولة، وهذا معناه بالضرورة أن تكون الدولة "ثيوقراطية" يحكمها رجال الدين (حاول أن تقلبها كيفما أردت بعقل واع مع الأخذ بالاعتبار جميع الشروط والمقاييس ولن تصل إلا إلى هذا).

أنا لا أضع "شروطاً مسبقة من عند أهلي للديمقراطية" يا صاحبي. أنا أقول فقط بأنك لا تستطيع تجاوز "الحليب واللبن" عندما تريد صنع "الجبنة"، ولن تستغني عن "الماء" عندما تنوي تحضير "فنجان قهوة"، ولن تخرج معك "بيتزا" جديرة باسمها دون "عجينة"، فهذه هي طبيعة الأشياء، وأنا لا أفعل سوى رصدها وليس اختلاقها.

ماذا نسمي هذه الأنظمة التي لا تفصل الدين عن الدولة وتحقق بهذا الحد الأدنى من "المجتمع المدني"؟ هذه النظم هي نظم أخرى "سائرة نحو الديمقراطية" (إن سعت إليها طبعاً) وعلينا أن نسميها حسب نوعيتها. وهي عامة لن تخرج عن "خمسة أطر" معروفة هي: "ملكية" أو "أرستقراطية" أو "أوليغارخية" أو "ثيوقراطية" أو "ديكتاتورية"، أو بعض أمزجة هذه. ولننوه بأن في جميع هذه الأطر هناك "آليات ديمقراطية" لن تجعلنا ببساطة نخلط بين "هيفاء وهبي" و"فضيحه حركات":)

واسلم لي
العلماني
04-17-2008, 10:13 PM
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الردود في هذا الموضوع
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة eyad 65 - 04-11-2008, 06:37 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة vodka - 04-11-2008, 08:58 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة Guru - 04-12-2008, 12:15 AM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة Serpico - 04-12-2008, 01:33 AM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة vodka - 04-12-2008, 02:01 AM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة Emile - 04-12-2008, 09:00 AM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة eyad 65 - 04-12-2008, 01:48 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة Romeo - 04-13-2008, 10:24 AM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة vodka - 04-13-2008, 01:04 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة Romeo - 04-13-2008, 01:49 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة Romeo - 04-13-2008, 01:52 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة vodka - 04-13-2008, 06:09 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة Serpico - 04-14-2008, 12:38 AM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة فضل - 04-14-2008, 12:51 AM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة vodka - 04-14-2008, 01:06 AM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة vodka - 04-14-2008, 01:06 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة eyad 65 - 04-14-2008, 03:04 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة Serpico - 04-16-2008, 03:08 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة Serpico - 04-16-2008, 03:10 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة Nils - 04-16-2008, 06:54 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة Nils - 04-17-2008, 01:36 PM,
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة العلماني - 04-17-2008, 10:13 PM
قلوبنا معك دكتور "فضل " ... - بواسطة AL3BASY - 04-21-2008, 01:16 PM,

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