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/global.php 958 eval
/showthread.php 28 require_once
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/global.php 961 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined property: MyLanguage::$bottomlinks_returncontent - Line: 6 - File: global.php(1070) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
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/inc/functions.php 3442 eval
/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
Warning [2] Undefined property: MyLanguage::$forumjump_select - Line: 5 - File: inc/functions.php(3442) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/functions.php 3442 eval
/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code 2 errorHandler->error_callback
/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/functions_post.php 898 pluginSystem->run_hooks
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/inc/class_plugins.php 142 thankyoulike_postbit
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الإعجاز العلمي في القرآن... رغم أنف الكافرين
أوريجانوس غير متصل
عضو فعّال
***

المشاركات: 189
الانضمام: May 2005
مشاركة: #94
الإعجاز العلمي في القرآن... رغم أنف الكافرين
الأخ الكريم "الصفي"، تحية طيبة.

وبعد،
فيا أخي الكريم أنا أعلم معنى: "بحر" في اللغة. وأصف هذا المعني بالبساطة فى التعبير والعلم، ففيم تختلف معي؟

يا أخي الكريم، خلاصة مداخلتي، أن القرآن في لفظة "بحر"، هو بسيط علمياً ولا يعني مطلقاً البحر الجغرافي الذي تصدعون به رؤوسنا عندما يصب فيه ماء النهر لتحقيق وضع "الفاصل المائي" !

حينما دخلت هذا التيه، خلت أنني سأدخل مختبراً علمياً لإجراء الأبحاث والشروحات ومقارنتها بما قاله القرآن. فإذ بي، بين قوم يلوون الكلمات بما يتوافق مع الأهواء، فتركوا البحر ( الجغرافي ) وحدثونا بالبحر ( اللغوي ) ! ويحكم، وهل أنا الذي أدخل العلم في القرآن أم أنتم؟ وهل وجدتني أنتقد القرآن في مقولته عن البحر لغوياً أم جغرافياً؟

أكرر: ثقافة كاتب القرآن هي ثقافة ضحلة علمياً، قوية بلاغياً، ككل شعراء مكة إبان حقبة المعلقات.

أكرر مرة أخري: كاتب القرآن، يتكلم باللغة السائدة ومعانيها ومفاهيمها، ولا يعني ولا يدرك أصلاً البحر الجغرافي.

لحظة، هل تعلم يا أخى الكريم الفارق أم لا؟
هل تعلم تعريف "النهر" وتعريف "البحر" في الجغرافيا أم لا؟
أشك أنك تعلم فعلاً، فأنت تشير للبحر الجغرافي منكراً ومؤولاً بأنه "معنى إصطلاحي نستعمله اليوم"!


اقتباس:عن اي علم تتكلم يا سيد اورجانوس؟ فان تسميتك اساسا خاطئة و لا علاقة لها باللغة العربية. فالمعنى اللغوي لكلمة بحر غير المعنى الاصطلاحي الذين نستعمله اليوم.
أتحدث عن علم الجغرافيا يا أخي الكريم.
لا شأن لمصطلحات الجغرافيا بالصحة اللغوية يا أخي الكريم. فهناك علم يسمي "إقتصاد" بينما - لغوياً - قد أدخلها في تعبير مثل "إقتصاد منزلي" أعني به الطبخ والأكل والمعجونات ولا علاقة له من قريب أو بعيد بمصطلح إقتصاد.

اللغة العربية، لغة مطاطة، لست أدري كم مرة سنعيد هذا القول. بينما لغة الإصطلاحات العلمية، حاسمة، قاطعة.
حينما تقول لي: البحر في القرأن قد يعني النهر أو البحر في الجغرافيا.
أقول: موافق. فاللغة تسمح بهذا.

حينما تقول لي: القرآن يتحدث عن "الحد المائي الفاصل لإختلاف الكثافة"
أقول: متمسح برداء العلم بالباطل، فلغة القرآن، عربية، مسطحة، لا تضع فارقاً بين المالح والعذب. وكله عند العرب: ماء يجري في شقوق.


اقتباس:المشكلة انك انت من تريد ان توهمنا .فايات سورة الرحمن اساسا لا تتحدث عن بحر ( ملح اجاج) و بحر( عذب فرات) , و انما تتحدث عن التقاء بحرين . فمن اين اتيت بان احدهما نهرعذب؟
لم أتِ بهذا من عند "أمي" ( حفظها الله )
بل من أخيك الكريم الذي أتي بها كإعجاز علمي على "الحد الفاصل" والذ يستدعي بالضرورة أن يكون أحدهما عذب والآخر مالح وإلا لما كان لهذا علاقة بالموضوع العلمي ! هل أنت متأكد أنك متابع معنا؟ أم أتيت لترد بلا قراءة للسياق.

وكلامك عن البحرين الكلاهما مالح، هو خطأ. وأنظر التفاسير:


ابن كثير في تفسير قوله: يَخْرُجُ مِنْهُمَا اللُّؤْلُؤُ وَالْمَرْجَانُ
وَأَمَّا قَوْله " وَمِنْ كُلٍّ تَأْكُلُونَ لَحْمًا طَرِيًّا وَتَسْتَخْرِجُونَ حِلْيَة تَلْبَسُونَهَا " فَاللَّحْم مِنْ كُلٍّ مِنْ الْأُجَاج وَالْعَذْب

ثم تلي هذه الجملة، مذبحة للعلم !!
على فكرة، كلما جعلتونا نبحث بحياد عن "الإعجاز"، لكلما وجدنا "عجزاً جديداً"


قَالَ اِبْن عَبَّاس مَا سَقَطَتْ قَطُّ قَطْرَة مِنْ السَّمَاء فِي الْبَحْر فَوَقَعَتْ فِي صَدَفَة إِلَّا صَارَ مِنْهَا لُؤْلُؤَة وَكَذَا قَالَ عِكْرِمَة وَزَادَ فَإِذَا لَمْ تَقَع فِي صَدَفَة نَبَتَتْ بِهَا عَنْبَرَة وَرُوِيَ مِنْ غَيْر وَجْه عَنْ اِبْن عَبَّاس نَحْوه وَقَدْ قَالَ اِبْن أَبِي حَاتِم حَدَّثَنَا أَحْمَد بْن سِنَان حَدَّثَنَا عَبْد الرَّحْمَن بْن مَهْدِيّ حَدَّثَنَا سُفْيَان عَنْ الْأَعْمَش عَنْ عَبْد اللَّه بْن عَبْد اللَّه عَنْ سَعِيد بْن جُبَيْر عَنْ اِبْن عَبَّاس قَالَ : إِذَا أَمْطَرَتْ السَّمَاء فَتَحْت الْأَصْدَاف فِي الْبَحْر أَفْوَاههَا فَمَا وَقَعَ فِيهَا يَعْنِي مِنْ قَطْر فَهُوَ اللُّؤْلُؤ . إِسْنَاده صَحِيح

http://quran.al-islam.com/Tafseer/DispTafs...Sora=55&nAya=22

لمن لا يعرف، فاللؤلؤ، هو حبة رمل، تسللت داخل صدفة لتبيت عندها، فآلمت ذلك الحيوان الرخو المسكين بداخل الصدفة، فجلس ليبكي من جراء حبة الرمل المتطلفة، فكونت دموع حزنه الوقور ما نسميه: لؤلؤة.

ويقولون أن اللؤلؤ، هو قطرات المطر الساقطة في البحر. ( إعجاز علمي ؟ ) ياللجهل المتردي. ألم يكن من الأفضل لدعاة الإعجاز الإلتزام بفضيلة الصمت؟

على فكرة يا أخي الكريم، يمكنك مطالعة باقي التفاسير من الرابط السابق حول نفس الآية، وستجدها جميعاً تقول أحدهما مالح والآخر عذب.
لماذا تحاول إيهامنا أن كلاهما مالح؟



العجز الرابع، لن أتوقف عنده فلم أجد له أي معنى.
"عظام نخرة" هو تعبير شائع في اللغة العربية، ولا يوجد به أي شيئ علمي أو غيره. فلفظة "نخرة" هي صفة للعظام واضحة بالرؤية، ولا يوجد بها شيئ غريب. هل فرغت جعبتك أم ماذا؟

نلتقي مع الخامسة بعد الفاصل.
06-05-2005, 03:08 PM
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الإعجاز العلمي في القرآن... رغم أنف الكافرين - بواسطة أوريجانوس - 06-05-2005, 03:08 PM

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