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/global.php 958 eval
/showthread.php 28 require_once
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/global.php 961 eval
/showthread.php 28 require_once
Warning [2] Undefined variable $board_messages - Line: 28 - File: global.php(961) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 28 require_once
Warning [2] Undefined property: MyLanguage::$bottomlinks_returncontent - Line: 6 - File: global.php(1070) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/global.php 1070 eval
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/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
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/inc/functions.php 3442 eval
/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
Warning [2] Undefined property: MyLanguage::$forumjump_select - Line: 5 - File: inc/functions.php(3442) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/functions.php 3442 eval
/showthread.php 673 build_forum_jump
Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1686) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/class_error.php 153 errorHandler->error
/showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code 2 errorHandler->error_callback
/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code 2 errorHandler->error_callback
/showthread.php 1690 eval
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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Warning [2] Undefined variable $posttime - Line: 2 - File: showthread.php(1690) : eval()'d code PHP 8.1.2-1ubuntu2.19 (Linux)
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/inc/class_plugins.php 142 thankyoulike_postbit
/inc/functions_post.php 898 pluginSystem->run_hooks
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/inc/class_plugins.php 142 thankyoulike_postbit
/inc/functions_post.php 898 pluginSystem->run_hooks
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/inc/class_plugins.php 142 thankyoulike_postbit
/inc/functions_post.php 898 pluginSystem->run_hooks
/showthread.php 916 build_postbit
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/showthread.php 1224 eval





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هل كانت السيدة العذراء أخت موسى النبي
تحية يا عبد المسيح،
سنغض الطرف عن تطاولك اللامبرر على الرسول والحج في شريط آخر، لكن بعد أن نقول لك "حتى أنت يا بروتس".

اقتباس:  ABDELMESSIH67   كتب/كتبت  
 
الأخوة الأفضل , عندما نطالع سفر التكوين نجد الآتي بخصوص أهل موسى و هارون

تكوين 6 : 20 وَأَخَذَ عَمْرَامُ يُوكَابَدَ عَمَّتَهُ زَوْجَةً لَهُ. فَوَلَدَتْ لَهُ هَارُونَ وَمُوسَى. وَكَانَتْ سِنُو حَيَاةِ عَمْرَامَ مِئَةً وَسَبْعاً وَثَلاَثِينَ سَنَةً.

و نجد الآتي أيضا من أخوة موسى و هارون

سفر التكوين 15 : 19فَإِنَّ خَيْلَ فِرْعَوْنَ دَخَلَتْ بِمَرْكَبَاتِهِ وَفُرْسَانِهِ إِلَى الْبَحْرِ وَرَدَّ الرَّبُّ عَلَيْهِمْ مَاءَ الْبَحْرِ. وَأَمَّا بَنُو إِسْرَائِيلَ فَمَشُوا عَلَى الْيَابِسَةِ فِي وَسَطِ الْبَحْرِ». 20فَأَخَذَتْ مَرْيَمُ النَّبِيَّةُ أُخْتُ هَارُونَ الدُّفَّ بِيَدِهَا وَخَرَجَتْ جَمِيعُ النِّسَاءِ وَرَاءَهَا بِدُفُوفٍ وَرَقْصٍ. 21وَأَجَابَتْهُمْ مَرْيَمُ: «رَنِّمُوا لِلرَّبِّ فَإِنَّهُ قَدْ تَعَظَّمَ! الْفَرَسَ وَرَاكِبَهُ طَرَحَهُمَا فِي الْبَحْرِ!».

لقد كان موسى النبي و هارون أخيه أولاد عمرام لهم أخت أسمها مريم و هي أيضا أبنة عمرام بحسب الكتاب المقدس و لكن الغريب أننا نجد أن القرآن ذكر ان العذراء مريم أم السيد المسيح كانت ابنة ( عمران ) و غالبايقصد  ( عمرام ) كما هو دون بالكتاب المقدس و أخت هارون ……. فهل بهذا نفهم أن السيدة العذراء هي أخت موسى النبي أيضا ؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟

هل تريد أن تقنعنا يا زميلنا العزيز أن اليهود قد سمو عمرام مرة واحدة لشخص واحد في كل تاريخ الأمة اليهودية؟ يعني ما صار أنهم قد أحبوا موسى فسموا على اسمه، وأحبوا كل من قرب من موسى من اب أو أخ أو أخت فسموا على اسمه؟
إن كان اسم مريم، وهو أخت موسى، قد انتشر بين اليهود لدرجة أننا نجد بينهم ثلاثة نساء كل اسمها مريم واقفات تحت الصليب كما تروون، فلم لا يكون هناك من تسمى بعمرام غير عمرام أبي موسى؟
ثم أنت تسميه عمرام، هل أنت تنقل حرفيا من الأصل العبري؟ أنت إذ تكتب بالعربية، فالعرب قد نقلت عمرام إلى عمران حتى يناسب لسان العرب، ومثله جمع المذكر السالم العبري ينتهي بالميم بينما العربي ينتهي بالنون، انظر إذا شئت حاخاميم و حاخامين. وكذا عمرام وعمران. هذه هي اللغة إن كنت ترغب أن تتقنها.


كيف و يفصل بينهم 1600 عاما ؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟

لقد واجه أهل الكتاب رسول الاسلام بهذا الخطأ الذي فهمه العديد من الصحابة بل و السيدة عائشة زوجته أيضا على أن السيدة العذراء هي أخت موسى و هارون فأجاب بالآتي :

من تفسير ابن كثير للآية 28 من سورة آل عمران .

http://quran.al-islam.com/Tafseer/D...Sora=19&nAya=28

يَا أُخْت هَارُون " أَيْ شَبِيهَة هَارُون فِي الْعِبَادَة " مَا كَانَ أَبُوك اِمْرَأَ سَوْء وَمَا كَانَتْ أُمّك بَغِيًّا " أَيْ أَنْتِ مِنْ بَيْت طَيِّب طَاهِر مَعْرُوف بِالصَّلَاحِ وَالْعِبَادَة وَالزَّهَادَة فَكَيْف صَدَرَ هَذَا مِنْك قَالَ عَلِيّ بْن أَبِي طَلْحَة وَالسُّدِّيّ قِيلَ لَهَا " يَا أُخْت هَارُون " أَيْ أَخِي مُوسَى وَكَانَتْ مِنْ نَسْله كَمَا يُقَال لِلتَّمِيمِيِّ يَا أَخَا تَمِيم وَلِلْمِصْرِيِّ يَا أَخَا مُضَر وَقِيلَ نُسِبَتْ إِلَى رَجُل صَالِح كَانَ فِيهِمْ اِسْمه هَارُون فَكَانَتْ تُقَاس بِهِ فِي الزَّهَادَة وَالْعِبَادَة


قد دلك محمد صلى الله عليه وسلم على الفهم الصائب، فما المشكلة؟
هل عندكم في ما تقرؤون من كتاب اسم لوالد السيدة مريم سلام الله عليها غير اسم عمران؟


لقد واجه نصارى نجران الصحابي الجليل المغير بن شعبة (الذي فلت بزناه مع أم جميل من الحد
و ذلك بفضل عمر بن الخطاب
) واجهوه بهذا الخطأ فلم يجد رد فذهب الى النبي فتفتق ذهنه
على أن اليهود كانوا يسمون بأسماء أنبيائهم و لهذا سميت العذراء أبنة عمران , رغم ان عمران
لم يرد ذكره على أنه نبي.

الخطأ الأول أنك قد نسبت إلى المغيرة الزنا مع أم جميل، أنت هنا قد قذفت اثنين، بل واتهمت عمر أنه متواطئ.
لنضع رأي عمر جانبا، ونتخذك قاضيا ديانا على الرجل والمرأة. هل رأيت المغيرة يزني مع ام جميل؟ هل عندك شاهد عيان رآهما يزنيان؟ هل عندك حكم محكمة قد أثبتت عليهما الزنا؟ فإن كان لا فلم تفتري على العالمين وقد نهيت عن ذلك؟
أما الخطأ الثاني، فهو انقاص الجملة التي أردت الاستدلال بها من التفسير، فالقول كان أنبيائهم وصالحيهم، وأنت اقتصرت على الأنبياء وأهملت الصالحين، هل هذا تصرف مقصود؟



من التفسير أيضا نجد أشارة لمريم بنت عمران ( عمرام في الكتاب المقدس ) و كيف أنهم قرؤا في التوراة أنها أخت موسى و هارون مما يؤكد أن من كتب القرآن كان يقرأ و ينقل من الكتاب المقدس ( التوراة ) .

استدلال تحكمي، مبني على وجهة نظر سابقة، لذا لن نناقشه!

و نرى كيف أن محمد بن كعب القرظي الصحابي قرأ نفس الكلام في التوراة وفهم أن مريم أخت هارون
هي نفسها العذراء مريم أم عيسى .

محمد بن كعب القرظي صحابي؟ عفوا لكني لم أسمع عن ذلك إلا منك. قد تكون مصيبا، لكن أطلب أن تبين لي كيف قد عرفت أنه صحابي!
عموما حتى لو افترضنا جدلا أنه صحابي، قالصحابي ليس نبيا، ولا ينزل عليه الروح القدس كما ترون أنه ينزل على الحواريين الكرام! الصحابي إنسان يجتهد، ويصيب ويخطئ، ونقلده إن شئنا، أو نقلد غيره من الصحابة أو غيرهم، أو نجتهد إن ملكنا الآلة. إلا أن رأي الصحابي الفرد ليس دليلا لا في زمنهم ولا في زمننا!


لو فرضنا جدلا أن العذراء مريم سميت ( أخت هارون ) لأنها تشبهه في العبادة فهل أيضا
تطابق اسم أبيها ( عمران ) المذكور في القرآن مع عمرام أبو موسى و هارون أيضا .

يعني هل يعقل أن يتطابق أٍسم والد السيدة العذراء و أسم أخيها مع مريم أخت موسى دون أن يكون قصد من كتب القرآن أن يتحدث عن نفس الشخصية ؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟؟

الخوف هو أحد منتجات الألبان، فلا يعقل أن من أسمائه الجبن إلا وهو مشتق من الألبان بالتجبين!
ولكم السلام و التحية
عبد المسيح

والختام سلام!
03-28-2005, 06:17 PM
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الردود في هذا الموضوع
هل كانت السيدة العذراء أخت موسى النبي - بواسطة خالد - 03-28-2005, 06:17 PM

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